Polygamy, and the Nature of Man and Woman: Part 2

Taliban_beating_woman_in_public_RAWAOne of the most frequent lies from muslim polygamy apologists is that polygyny is natural based on the differences between the sexes. The topic has been discussed on this blog several times, proving the absurd falsehood of this argument.

A muslim scholar wrote:

Lastly, there is the component of rebellion. It is human nature on part of man that he simply cannot tolerate someone else having conjugal relationships with his wife. In the case of polygyny, the jealousy of a woman is curbed by the leadership of her husband. In polyandry however, both men are on equal footing. As has been noted above, besides gender any other impartial variable available is absent which gives rise to a vacuum ready to be filled with adversity. When women fight, they pull each other’s hair. When men fight, they go to war.

A woman can not tolerate someone else having conjugal relationships with her husband either. It is inherently evil to us, disgusting and nauseating. Women “tolerate” it on the same basis people tolerate being beaten, raped, enslaved. Women tolerate it to survive. Women tolerate it in order to keep from going insane. Women tolerate it out of fear. Women tolerate it to be allowed paradise after death since they are doomed by polygyny to live in hell here on earth.

If a man is chained to a wall, physically or psychologically, he “tolerates” somebody making love to his wife too, even while he is obliged to watch.

That’s the basic truth.

“The jealousy of a woman is curbed by the leadership of her husband”. How, may I ask? How did the mere presence of my husband’s leadership curb my jealousy? Did you, dear scholar, ask any women about this? Any single woman? Because this is such major BS I can’t believe you managed to get it out of your head and down on paper. It isn’t “the leadership of her husband” that makes a woman try to survive polygyny. Nor is it her love for her husband. Do you want to know what it is?

“When women fight, they pull each other’s hair. When men fight, they go to war.”. This is actually an argument in favour of polyandry and against polygyny. Yes, men go to war. Men kill each other. Men beat and kill women. So, any loving and wise god would make MEN submit to polyandry and sharing and working on their lower instincts, since they are obviously the ones who need it!

The falsehoods, misogyny, heresy and sanctimoniousness of muslim scholars never ceases to amaze me.

But even more, it amazes me that women buy into this nauseous toxic goo.

Who is the Head of Your Polygamous Family? Q&A

921ce-keep-calm-and-you-can-do-it-13Good day and thank you for a very interesting blog.

Being muslim, I have some questions to the blogkeeper. I do not intend disrespect and I do understand if you find my questions too private. I respect of course if you do not answer anything that may be too close.

It seems to me in polygamy, somebody must be the leader. Somebody must have the final call if there are conflicts of wishes, time or jealousy. In Islam the man is the leader. He has the final say and it is his responsibility to keep peace and harmony in the marriages. I wonder, in your marriages, is this your role? Or are your husbands still the leaders in marriage? Maybe they solve conflicts between them since you live close together?

When your husbands want things that conflict, to whom do you submit? I see you have a child with your second husband, how would you have solved it if your first husband wanted a child too, at the same time?

If two wives argue and scream and threaten each other, the husband is always strong enought to make them calm down and give in to his will. What do you do if your husbands fight?

I am sorry if this question offends, but if both your husbands have wish for intimacy, does it not make you feel tired and worn out? And how can you cope with two men if they want you at the same time? And is it not embarassing to go to your one husband with plainly traces of ghusl so he can see what you have done with the other?

I truly wish you well. But I must say I find this way of living strange. Please forgive me.

Harish

3 Most Common Complaints in Polygamy

maleslaveWe have settled into a calm life of polygamy, plain sailing most of the time. The conflicts that do arise are mostly minor and easily settled. When my first husband was still with his #2 there were LOADS of conflicts all the time, every single mole hill turned into a mountain. Not so now. That just shows how important it is that polygamy is voluntary, just and equal. And it clearly shows that women don’t cope with sharing a spouse better than men – it’s all about how polygamy is done, not about gender.

Anyway, now and then we keep stumbling over minor issues, the typical complaints of polygamy. The most common complaints being:

1. Time issues. There is no way everybody concerned in polygamous marriage will be content with the division of time. Weekends, holidays, anniversaries… the best way to cope, for us anyway, has been to set a three day schedule (it used to be four, but we changed it because of Tamsin) and stick to it no matter what. In the beginning we allowed for my husbands to choose three set dates each, so Graham e.g. chose Christmas Day, his birthday and our anniversary. (If you want, you can find an early post of mine showing how I used this system to get at my husband’s #2!) We had to give up on that too, because if something happened that forced me to give the “set date” to the other husband, like somebody being ill, it just made matters worse… “You always give up my time, and now you even gave him my set date!!”. So no, now we have a three day schedule, with 14 days holiday for each husband. And Christmas Day together. This way nobody is completely satisfied, and there are always grumblings about the schedule.

2. Intimacy. There is no way ever anybody can be completely at ease with sharing the person you love sexually with somebody else. I have to be very careful about e.g. not wanting sex, because both my husbands would see that as a sign that I might be more attracted to the other one. If I am uninterested in sex on change over day, the husband I just came home to would interpret that to say that I just had sex with the other husband before I left him (which might be true) and this always triggers hurt and jealousy. For me, this really isn’t a problem since I can always just have sex anyway, but I don’t understand how polygynous men handle it. I have also made a habit of taking a shower and changing clothes the first thing I do when I change homes. I used to get complaints about the way I smelled, Mark e.g. buys me very spicy perfumes, Escada is a favourite, while Graham prefers light scents like Happy. Ok, so I shower and change. That way, I also get rid of most of the scent I carry from the other husband. Graham only uses Clinique deo without scent, but Mark usually wears a rather heavy Gaultier perfume. Anyway, they both claim that they can smell each other on me, so I shower and change clothes. I’m also very careful about intimate hygiene. If a candida infection starts bouncing back and fro, it’s really irritating and also makes my husbands intimately aware that they are sharing body fluids so I do everything I can to avoid that. It was extremely difficult while I was pregnant I can tell you! I also avoid changing my behaviour in any way, such changes only cause jealousy, so if a husband wants something new to happen in bed – he has to initiate it himself!

3. The Wall of Silence. The silence that is caused by the fact that my husbands can share everything with me, but I have to be very careful about what I share with them. Some doors just have to be kept locked. I usually try to avoid ending up having to say “I can’t share that with you” or “I can’t tell you that”, but when I do it can cause weeks of grief. It’s a permanent conflict even when nothing really sets it off. Sometimes both Graham and Mark hide things from me, and try to hurt me by hiding things, just to sort of equal the field. And the fact remains – I am their best friend, but none of them can be mine.

Polygamy: It Provokes, and Unprovokes

???????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????We had a nice evening, even though the barrier was still there, the awkward silences. Tamsin was with her father, Mark payed her a short visit without me. Most of the time, Graham and Mark get along a lot better when I’m not around. It gave me time to do the dishes and take a shower. I longed to get close to my husband. I know from experience that being close physically often helps in closing a gap between us emotionally.

We snuggled. It was wonderful to be back in his arms, feel his warmth, hear him say he loves me.

Then it stopped. He couldn’t do it. Oh he tried, and tried. Then he told me he had had the same problems with #2. He said she felt like a stranger. They have become strangers to each other and he found himself wondering what the girl was doing in his bed. And then he felt like a real ass. She still loves him apparently. He said finally, the last two days, they reconnected in a way that allowed him to be intimate with her.

And now, that is causing him problems here. Guilt. Shame.

I tried to tell him I understand, that he should just leave it for a while, that it’s ok. He snarled at me, got dressed and left. Didn’t come back until two hours later. Said he was sorry but just didn’t want to talk about it. This has happened before. He has problems compartmentalizing, in his head love, sex, polygamy, cheating – it all gets mixed up.

He’s still asleep.

I’m sitting here wondering about what kind of morning we’ll have.

I do understand. Of course I do. But it’s for him to work out, I can’t help him.

This is another reason why women are more suited for polygamy, I’ll never have to worry about performance.

For men, polygamy provokes the desire, but it takes away the performance.

He Doesn’t Sleep With His Other Wife

Füssli_-_Symplegma_eines_Mannes_und_einer_Frau_mit_helfender_DienerinPolygamous husbands lie.

They lie to make things easier for themselves, to avoid conflicts and to please their wives.

They lie. And islamically, they are correct in doing so. And since it is islamically correct, no muslim can believe they’re wrong in doing so, or can they?

Islamic hadiths and fatwas tell men they have a right to lie to their wives, nay really an obligation. This is what it can sound like:

It is nothing new for your co-wives to argue and fight with one another. Upon you is to make each one feel as if she alone is the special one, the sweetest one, and the most beautiful one. And there is no harm in you lying in this regard. As the Prophet (saw) said:

“Lying is permissible only in three cases.” And one of them he mentioned was: “A husband (lying) in order to please his wife.“

So let each one of your wives feel as if they are the one who you love the most. Backbiting is indeed impermissible, so saying words like, “Honey, you do know I love you more than Faatimah and Safiyyah right?” Or when she does something which pleases you, say how she is the only one who can please you like that. And use your imagination, however make it sound as realistic as possible (I hope no sisters are reading this, lol).

Or:

It was narrated that Asma’ Bint Yazeed said: “The Messenger of Allah (peace and blessings of Allah be upon him) said: ‘It is not permissible to tell lies except in three (cases): when a man speaks to his wife in a way to please her; lying in war; and lying in order to reconcile between people.’”

(Narrated by al-Tirmidhi, 1939)

So muslim polygynists are taught to lie, they are taught to believe it is right to lie to their wives. Since muslim scholars also teach that women are weak, emotional, brittle creatures who should not even be allowed to leave their houses without a guardian, of course a muslim man has no problems believing it is his right to lie to his wives to “protect” them, as well as lock them up and beat them.

Forced polygyny is hell on earth, torture and unimaginable pain. Is there any wonder that women tend to cling to the lies they are told, in order to ease a fragment of the pain?

I have seen so many wives in polygyny claim that they are the favourite wife. They believe he loves them more, enjoys them more, that they are his best friend. Who can blame them? And the men know that by telling these lies, they keep feeding crack to their crack-whore wives. And islamic websites keep providing muslim polygynists the crack.

As far as first wives go, the usual lies seem to be “You are my first and only real love”, “You know me better, so you know better how to please me” “We share more memories and more love, and no other wife will ever catch up” “I only married a second because I pitied her”.

As far as second wives go the usual lies seem to be “My first wife and I haven’t loved each other for years, we just stay together because of the children/family” “My first wife is an ugly shrew, I never loved her” “My first wife is just a friend, we married for convenience”

And the most common lie all categories is “I don’t sleep with my other wife”.

(Or at least “..and if I do, I don’t enjoy it!) (…as much!)

When I see a woman in a polygynous marriage claim “My husband doesn’t sleep with his other wife”, it breaks my heart.

When I see somebody claim that something islamically correct can not be evil, it breaks my heart.

False Alarm!

120px-Pregnant_belly_buttonI started feeling contractions and Mark went and got Graham. As we left for hospital, it did feel weird to see Mark standing in the portico, watching us go.

I suppose fate wanted me to have a dress rehearsal. It turns out, baby’s not due just yet.

I need to relax, stop running around. So I sit here now and allow my husbands to care for me. Graham took me back to Mark, but he comes over every two minutes to check on me. They’ve decided to spend the evening together watching rugger. Perfect. I think being involved, being all together, makes things easier on Mark. I’m glad.

Of course, having babies in a polygamous marriage is always a strain. It’s a painful reminder to the other partner that his/her spouse is having an intimate relationship with the other husband/wife. It’s also a reminder that this isn’t going to change in the near future, we are building a life together and this is the strongest of all bonds.

I wish my parents had been here to see their new grandchild.

Polygamy and Disease

ThreeringsGraham took me to this extremely interesting event yesterday, a charity dinner combined with lectures.

One woman, Fatima, from the US told her story in a way that made me cry. She was 38 years old, a mother of two, her youngest son was only three years old. And she was dying.

Her husband had married a second wife 8 years ago. As usual, it had been against the wishes of the first wife. She said however that being a good muslimah she had tried to cope, and she had taken comfort in the fact that her husband had chosen to marry a divorced lady instead of a young virgin. She was happy that at least her husband was trying to live polygamy islamically, and not only looking for new, younger women.

A while back, Fatima had started to feel poorly. She had begun to experience pain during sex, and she found that she sometimes bled after intercourse. She also had a bad, continuous backpain.

They found she had cervical cancer. And it was beyond help. She is dying.

They told her papilloma virus was the reason she had cancer. And the papilloma virus had been brought to her by her husband from his other wife. The other wife never knew she had papilloma virus. Not all women get any symptoms at all from this.

80 million people in the US alone carry the virus. Many of them will never know, so they keep spreading it. Men won’t as easily get sick from it, but they give it to their women, and they might die. Fatima said polygyny is one of the reasons papilloma is spreading so rapidly. Many men still don’t make their new wives check for STD:s before they marry, and there are men who don’t care if their women have papilloma since it’s not as hazardous for males. And a lot of people don’t understand that e.g. papilloma virus spreads just as much among people who only have marital sex. So all you women out there living polygyny – you must be aware that your husband may be bringing death to your bed! As a small gift from his other wife…

So Fatima is dying, her children will loose their mother. Why? Because her husband chose polygamy. Because her husband forced her to share the papilloma virus with his second wife.

Polygyny killed Fatima.

It’s interesting to know that polyandry does not cause the same damage. A woman is five times as likely to contract e.g. gonorrhea, or cancer from papilloma virus, than a man. So in polyandry, the polygamous party is the one taking the major risk. In polygyny however, the polygamous male takes almost no risk. It’s the monogamous wives who have to pay the price for their polygamous husband. Another clear moral argument for polyandry, and against polygyny.

Are you Really telling Women to get Out There and Find Second Husbands Too?

imagesQuestion: Hello Fiona,

I’ve been reading your blog and quite enjoying it. You’ve got a great sense of humor and you seem to be a smart lady.

But I have to ask, are you really saying to women who have polygamous husbands that they can go out and get second husbands too?

So who will look after the children if their mothers go courting while the husband is tending his other family? And have your thought about the STD:s? How will the husband and his other wives be safe if his first wife has sex outside marriage? Or even if she “marries” another man as you suggest?

And what if her husband falls ill or something, should the first wife then be excused from visiting him in hospital because she is taking care of her other husband?

And who will make the decisions when there are two husbands? Can’t you see that this would lead to chaos.

And I’m sorry if I’m blunt Fiona (but you don’t seem to shy away from candid language) but I don’t think men would be a ble to share their wives intimately. I think men would find it gross and unbarable to know that their woman had been intimate with another man. They would never allow it. Most men don’t want a woman who’s ever been with another man. Having a wife who alternates between me and another man – no way! I would feel like she’s dirty and full of his touch. And I would picture the two of them – no way could I live with that.

You see, sex is more important to us and we think about it differently (and more! 🙂 )so it would never work.

And if she has babies, who will be the father?

I don’t think women could ever be polygamous. No way.

I enjoy your blog though!

Answer: Hi Isaak, thanks for your kind words about my blog.

Your first question is about the children. Children are always the equal responsibility of their parents. In polygyny, who will look after the children when the husband scuttles off to his second or fourth wife? 😦 If the woman has a second husband, there will still be a man and a male role model around the house even if the real father is off shagging somebody else. My suggestion is that the father and mother take turns with the children.

I have thought about STD:s believe me! I have a husband who married a teenage hussy su yes, it’s crossed my mind. In polygamy, any kind of polygamy, I believe all concerned should have regular check ups, and share the results with each other. I also would like to remind you that men get STD:s just as much as women so muslim men in polygyny ought to have a check up every month or so and share the results with their wives.

In real polygamy, the polygamous  wife is just as married as the polygamous husband!

If a spouse falls ill, I hope the other spouse will help and visit – this surely is not a question of gender?

In polygamous marriage, just like in monogamous marriage, I think decisions must be based on consensus. No biggie! Muslim men, and men overall, just have to learn to view and treat their wives as equal parties in Family Inc.

Here’s a surprise for you: Women in polygamy have exactly the same feelings about sex as you do! We find it gross and utterly disgusting that our husbands are being intimate with other women. We feel exactly the same way, and our imaginations show us exactly the same excruciating pictures!!!! Please read and understand this. To all men out there considering polygyny or living polygyny: This part of sharing your spouse is just as painful to women as it would be to you!!! Imagine it!! Picture it!!! Read my post “Love for your brother…” and try to understand. A polygamous husband is disgusting to all his wives because they know that he comes home carrying the touch, bacteria and acari of other women to his bed. He is contaminated by perpetual disgusting bacteria. He is disgusting because he is like having to share your home bathroom and toilet with other women who crap there without cleaning it after themselves. No quick shower would make a toilet a vessel another woman would like to drink out of!

Paterinity can nowadays be settled using a simple 2 min test.

Thanks for your post. Come again! 🙂

Having a Baby with a Polygamous Man

S%C3%A9pulcre_Arc-en-Barrois_111008_12I have met and heard from so many wives who are desperately miserable because their husbands are having a baby with his other wife. Other wives have contacted me because they are miserable since they have just had babies or are expecting babies with their polygamous husbands. Both ways, the wives are the losers. Not to mention the children.

Situation 1: The other wife is having a baby

Your husband is having a baby with his other wife. They are sharing the joy and expectancy – you are left out. They are waiting for the result of their love and love making to come and permanent the bond between them. They are sharing the most amazing experience in the world. They are, not you. He wants to talk about having children all the time, you definitely don’t. He hates it that you sulk instead. He is constantly on the phone with his second wife, checking that she’s ok, wondering if there’s anything she needs. She calls and texts him constantly. Suddenly she is having the baby – on your night. When the call comes your husband up and leaves. You’re alone, knowing that he is becoming a father to another woman’s baby. He sends you pictures of the baby from the hospital. He texts you about how beautiful the baby is, about how happy he is, about how amazing it all is. He writes that he hopes that one day you will get to experience this too.

Life changes. When he’s with you he keeps talking about his child, he wants you to admire the pictures. He gets texts all the time, smiles and leaves the room. Sometimes he comes home to you on nights that are hers. You are happy, put on your best lingerie and he makes love to you, then he tells you he came over because he wants to sleep and sleep is difficult with a baby around. The next day he calls you and says he must make the night up to #2 so he will be away a couple of days because he wants to take his little family away on holiday. You realize, you will never again be anything but a matter of convenience.

Situation 2: You are having a baby

You’re having a baby. You call your husband when you get the result because he is with his other wife. You are so happy. You call him a couple of times more because you are so happy and need to talk about it – he tells you that his other wife is getting angry because of the calls so he asks you not to call. When you go to parents’ class, you have to go alone. All other women there bring their husbands, you’re alone. When they ask why you lie and say he’s abroad. You can’t tell them he’s polygamous. The first time you can feel the baby moving, you’re alone. You send a text to your husband. When you spend day after day vomiting, you’re alone because he’s off making love to his other wife. You go shopping for things for the baby alone. One day he takes you to the mall and buys a crib, a pram and a lot of other things You spend a wonderful day together. Then he tells you that he must spend an equal amount of money on his other wife so he’s taking her on a short holiday. But you can text his brother if you need anything while he’s away shagging his other wife.

The night you’re having the baby, he’s with his other wife. You call him and he says that when it gets real, he’ll be there.  You call him from the hospital and he says he’s coming. It’s a two hour drive normally but because of roadwork it takes him three hours to get there. You have to go through most of the delivery alone. You have lied to the ob about your husband having to take care of his sick mother. You have to suffer the pain and fear alone. When your baby is born, your husband takes pictures of the baby and sends them to his other wife. He tells you he’s been talking about names with his other wife and they have some suggestions. After a couple of days, he leaves to go to his other wife. You are alone when your baby has stomach cramps, you carry the baby around hour after hour in your arms, making soothing noises, still suffering from extreme pains after the delivery and sleep deprivation because you haven’t been able to sleep during the last weeks of your pregnancy. You can’t take turns because your husband is with his other wife. The slim one, with no baby to keep him up at night. When your baby has his first fever, your husband is with his other wife. You text him and take a taxi to the hospital. It turns out to be colics. Your baby cries night after night, you walk and soothe. Your husband says he can’t stand not being allowed to sleep, so he spends extra time with his other wife. When you call him to talk about how alone and tired you are he says you can’t call so often and you can hear the shower running in the background and you understand he has just been making love to his other wife. He says he’ll call you in the morning. You realize, you will never again be anything but a matter of convenience.

And the child. The suffering of the child, wanting a father, longing for a father, has only begun.

Ana and the Other Murderers

By: D S Pruitt

By: D S Pruitt

A revert muslim, Ana, has stated repeatedly that she considers child marriages islamic. She says a child is ready to marry as soon as she has her menses, if she is 5, 6 or seven years old doesn’t matter. According to Ana, marrying a child is islamic if she only has had her menses and having sexual intercourse with her is islamic as soon as the nikah has been performed.

Ana hence approves of 50, 60 and 70 year old men marrying little children, girls aged 5 or 6 and she claims it is islamic for these men to have sex with their brides:

That a child is not ready to have children even if she has her menses at age 6 doesn’t matter to Ana. That a child might not be able to understand what marriage means, that a child might not want to marry an 80 year old man, that a 7 year old might not dare oppose her parents’ wish to marry her off to an old sheik is of no importance to Ana.

That children die from giving birth, that children die from internal bleeding after having been raped by their “husbands” is of no importance to Ana. An 80 year old man marrying a 5 year old girl and having sex with her is islamic according to Ana.

This means Ana is condoning murder. It is her, and people like her, who make sure the traditions allowing child marriages survive. It is religious fanatics like her who make sure it is impossible to change the laws that allow child marriages.

It is Ana, and people like her, who murder children like this 8 year old girl who died after her wedding night, from internal injuries after having been defiled by her +40 year old husband. Every person who defends the right of old men to marry children is a murderer, and bears the responsibility of these girls’ deaths.

This little girl could have been saved by a law preventing child marriages, but as you can see such a law was prevented by conservative muslims who claim that  a law to that effect would be unislamic.

The blood of this child is on them. Her death is on them. On them and on everybody who claims that god wants men to marry baby girls and have sex with them.